Some low-confidence takes about cross-cultural interactions between Western EAs and non-Western EAs

By Yi-Yang @ 2024-07-24T03:28 (+19)

I was investigating cross-cultural interactions (CCIs) in the EA community and I found evidence showing that CCIs are likely to be a common but minor problem for most non-westerners.

Some people have told me that they were looking forward to seeing if there are ways to improve this situation. I’m sympathetic, but I only have a few low-confidence takes on what can be done, considering I’ve not done more work to figure out which interventions work best and have a low risk of being accidentally harmful.

If you’re interested in knowing how to contribute in this space, I’ve listed some potential research areas here. And if you’re still interested to hear what I have to say, please read on.

Caveats

This is probably the weakest writing in my series of posts around CCIs in the EA community. I don’t have a lot of strong evidence to back up what I have to say here, and it feels more like a brain-dump for me.

Some non-Western EAs wish people were less worried about offending them, and others have the opposite preference. So try not to over-correct or over-update. And keep in mind that perhaps the opposite advice may be better for you.

If you haven’t read the SAE <> Microaggression and Internalised Racism document yet, I recommend you take a quick skim, because I referenced a few of examples from there and it also shows that I’ve covered a sliver of potential subtle acts of exclusion. I did cover more ground than what’s shown in this writing, but decided against including them because they’re more speculative, less well-thought out, and more controversial.

What to do if you have an uncomfortable CCI

CCIs are hard, and not everyone has a lot of experience with them. A person I interviewed mentioned that they’ve done “meta-conversations to deconfuse certain non-verbal cues”, and I suspect such conversations are probably helpful in deconfusing many types of CCIs, not just non-verbal ones.

What are they? Meta-conversations are conversations that are primarily about another conversation. For example, you might find that a discussion with your partner got a little too heated and you suggest having a meta-conversation with them to find out ways to mollify each other in future discussions.

To be more specific, meta-conversations to deconfuse CCIs are conversations that are primarily about another conversation that’s cross-culture. For example, you might find a CCI with a person was a little uncomfortable to you, and you suggest having a meta-conversation with them to figure out why it was uncomfortable and how this could change in the future.

Here are some prompts you could use to initiate a meta-conversation:

• “Hey, I noticed that I’m feeling very confused about this interaction. Do you mind if we talk about it really quickly?”
• “I don’t feel quite happy about what happened. Is it okay if we chat about our interaction just now?”
• “When you do X, what are you communicating?”

Jokes or backhanded compliments

This is probably very obvious and very rare in the EA community, but it might be worth spelling it out. Subtle acts of exclusions (SAEs) disguised as jokes or compliments are generally pretty off-putting, especially towards people who are new to the community. Some examples are:

• Making jokes about other people’s names
  • However, I think (?) it’s generally fine when close friends rib each other using non-insulting race-related jokes in private, especially if they've established that they're okay with it. I’m not sure though. 
• Backhanded compliments about one’s use of the English language.
  • This is a tricky one, again, because it’s hard to know what a person’s intentions are, but I’m guessing that there are four kinds of compliments:
    • Ones that come from haughtiness (a mix of contempt and arrogance)
      • Some people act as if they are a qualified arbiter of the English language and that one should savour compliments from such a high-status person. Or some people may have unreasonably high expectations for non-native speakers to be great in English.
      • But I suspect that this is probably the least common of the three.
    • Ones that come from a mix of ignorance and admiration
      • When someone is surprised by something, what they expected and what reality is has differed. So when people are surprised by some non-Western folks’ English skills, either:
        • They’re genuinely ignorant about the state of English literacy in many parts of the world (you can find out more here!), or
        • They’re genuinely impressed, because one may have a better grasp of English to the norm, and it’s hard to learn more than one language for many people, or
        • A mix of both
      • I don’t think non-Westerners should blame people for being ignorant (in most cases), but I think we do get a little offended sometimes--it’s almost like “being complimented on walking properly”.
      • I guess some non-Westerners (including me) are ignorant about the state of ignorance regarding the state of English literacy. Or that we’re ignorant about the fact that we may be an outlier, and are surprised by such compliments.
    • Ones that come from a mix of all three.
      • Here’s a personal example that I see as haughty and ignorant. I remember being praised for my English in class by a lecturer from the US. From the way he conveyed it, I felt like he was snidely addressing the rest of the classroom that they should improve their English. It wasn’t even a fair comparison in the first place, because I have used English for most of my life (although not a level considered native).

What can a Western EA do?

• Don’t joke about people’s names.
• If you’re complimenting a non-Westerner’s English skills, make clear whether you’re coming from a place of ignorance, admiration, or both.
• You could also ask the other person what the dominant language is in their region or city, and whether they speak other languages.
• Remind yourself to be considerate.

What can a non-Western EA do?

• If you’re getting complimented by a Western person for your English skills, and if you’re unsure where they are coming from, ask them.

Norm hijacking

Sometimes I’ll see Western folks (usually unintentionally) hijacking norms or assuming Western norms are/should be the dominant one in a non-Western setting without negotiation. I also think this type of SAE is generally bad.

Here are some of my own personal examples in Malaysia:

• A discussion group in Malaysia I was a part of has a norm about raising one’s hands and letting the moderator pick the next speaker to make speaking time more fair. Western folks tend to not follow this norm, and tend to have an outsized speaking time (>50%) despite there being only 10-20% of them. To be fair, the moderator did not enforce this norm well, and I don’t know how other folks in the group felt about this.
• It’s a norm to not greet (or it’s a norm to at most give a slight acknowledgement) to strangers in a lift or a corridor at an apartment or hotel in Malaysia. I noticed Western folks violating this norm many times. And I noticed Malaysians (including me) greeting back, sometimes reluctantly and sometimes in a way that isn’t a big deal.

What can a Western EA do? Say, for example, if one is travelling to a non-Western country for a conference or a retreat.

• If the non-Western norms are harmless, the old adage of “When in Rome, do as the Romans do” sounds like a useful heuristic. If you’d like to change norms, ask and negotiate.
  • For example, if you come from a culture where interrupting people and being outspoken are the norms, and if you’re in a setting with opposite norms (which is more common in some, not all, East Asian or Southeast Asian settings), wait until people are done expressing themselves and aim to give a fairer speaking time to each person in the room.
• What if there are norms that are harmful to you? For example, fat-shaming in familial settings is a norm in some cultures. In such cases, enforcing your personal boundary or negotiating for a new norm for you seems reasonable.
• What if there are norms that you think harmful are harmful to others but not to you? For example, what if you noticed a non-Western person getting fat-shamed by a relative?
  • I would probably talk to a non-Western friend from the same culture and ask them about their thoughts about it. Be curious, you might be missing some crucial information. If not, you may cause more harm than good, like the damage caused by Matt Healy (from the band 1975) to the LGBTQ community in Malaysia.

What can a non-Western EA do? For example, if you’re an organiser of a conference or a retreat.

• Try to design norms that most of your target audience will be comfortable with, and  will align with your programme goals well.
  • But the not so obvious thing is to acknowledge that there’s some unseen incentive to follow norms that are higher status, which are typically Western in origin, like the two examples above. (There are also other ways to signal higher status, but I don’t think it’s relevant here.)
• I recommend taking charge of enforcing norms or negotiating norms, but they are sometimes scary and difficult to do. Here are some ways that I think might make enforcement of norms a bit easier:
  • Predict ahead what kinds of negative CCIs could happen (some rationalists may recommend using the inner simulator technique), and make clear some norms you want to see. For example, if you expect people to talk over others, have a rule, for example, that says only the person holding an object (like a ball) can speak.
  • Do expect at least a bit of norm violation, so be prepared to tell people to stop.
  • If you’re not used to telling people “no” and if you’re worried about getting into an argument, I usually find talking to norm violators after the session, in private, makes the conversation smoother. Or get a co-organiser who is more comfortable to do it.
• If you have ongoing problems with a person who repeatedly violates norms, or there is a concern about a power imbalance with a norm violator, you can also seek advice from
  • Other organisers of groups or conferences
  • CEA's community health team
  • If it is a CEA affiliated group, retreat or conference, your contact person at CEA.
• Norms from EA’s various code of conducts or norms around professionalism should take precedence. For example, if being late is a norm in your country, and you want to ensure people are on time, you should communicate that punctuality is expected in this specific setting.